I Wish I Could Take Away Your Pain with Brenda Seefeldt Amodea and Teresa Janzen

Have you ever wondered what to say when someone is going through a challenging season? Join Teresa and Brenda as they chat about words that bring hope and healing amid suffering. 

Today’s guest is Brenda Seefeldt Amodea (A-moh-day-ah)
Bio: Brenda is a pastor, speaker, wife, and mom to four men with their own brave stories. Brenda has written a helpful book about the people who have helped her carry her pain, I Wish I Could Take Away Your Pain. This book includes a long list of what not to do as well as the many small things to do that matter. She shares other stories about the beauty of her pain at https://www.Bravester.com

Transcript

0:03

Welcome to Radical Abundance. I'm your host there, Janssen. Have you ever wondered what to say to someone who's going through something really difficult? Well, today's guest is a specialist in what to say and maybe even what not to say. Brenda Sel Ameda is a pastor, a speaker, a wife. Four men who have their own brave stories, and she's written a book called, I Wish I Could Take Away Your Pain. And don't we all feel that way? Like we wish we could take away the pain, but instead we say something and maybe it's the right thing, or maybe it's not the right thing. Well, that's what we're gonna talk about today. Welcome to the show, Brenda. Thank you. Yes. It's all about that those awkward moments of your heart is good, or you wanna escape one of the two and then you don't know what to say. Yeah. And it's happened to all of us. Right. And especially right now, here we are in the midst of the holidays, the season of joy, and. We know that we're going to encounter some folks who are not feeling it. They're not going through a joyfilled time, and for a lot of people this is a hard time knowing what to say and what not to say can be really helpful. So thank you for that. But first, let me ask you, why did you write this book? You must have a story. This book is, it's a very short book. It's very easy to read. Got pictures in it. But my story is in this book, but it's my stories, one of my getting my heart smashed and the decision to get up again. Those are my brave decisions to, you know, trust God and push through and find God again. But the better part of my story is the people who were with me and helped me get up again, and that's who this book is dedicated to. This is to the ones who were with me in my pain, who didn't give me a platitude, didn't give me a drive-by prayer, saw me stuck with me, said words that. I would say I don't believe are true, or I don't, you know, I could actually say those words too, because I knew they were safe people and they were with me in it, and they're the ones that helped me get up again and just continue living this life that I have. So that's the story of my life, is I keep making brave decisions. They're vulnerable, and I get hurt, and then I ask where God is, and then I find God again. And we want to be the people who are going to point someone and lead someone to the Lord in the midst of their pain, but without the platitude because it's so easy to say things like, Oh, God will comfort you, or God is teaching you something through this and or maybe you've sinned, or some of these types of things. I think those might not be the most helpful things to say. Because what you just did in that very moment, and again, it's this awkward moment, and, but what you just did is you just removed yourself from my pain. I am living it. I am. And I dare tell you. And then you say something like that. You just took yourself out of it. Put, you know, maybe a judgment on me or an assumption on me again. And I can't find God in this moment. I mean, I. I'm a pastor. I've been a pastor for 40 years. This is all I know. Yet there are moments when pain is so great and I just don't know where God is anymore, and I need to see, I need to see God again, and that is in you. But I need you to be with me in my pain. I need you, even your face to be with me in my. So, but this is what I've learned is I don't just share this with everybody. My story involves prison. I got, two of the boys I raised are in prison right now. And the minute you say that to most people, their faces will change, right? They, and I mean, and I don't blame them, they don't, Prison's a part of my life every day. It's become a very normal part of my life every day. For others, you don't touch the justice system. You don't deal with the injustice of the justice system, and you don't want to. Your life is full enough, your life is overflowing. You're doing all you can to continue your life together as it is. And so if I would just share that with you and expect you to enter in that pain with me, I setting myself up maybe to be hurt by you because maybe you don't have the capacity for that. But what I have learned is to find the people beforehand who I can share this stuff with, and then I do when it's a safe setting. And I, you know, and they do not, they're not afraid of the awkward, they're not afraid of, they don't show it on their face. And they will ask me the questions, they'll ask me the hard questions. And then when I become very overwhelmed and I've lost my bearings, They will ask me, they're really hard questions, and they'll tell me the things I need to hear again and again and again. So I'm kind of hearing two sides of the whole thing. You know, one side is. When I have something, a hard story I'm going through and I'm interacting with people who may not respond in a way that really feeds and nurtures and uplifts me. How, what can I do about that? And then the other side is when you are the person who encounters someone who's struggling and they hit you with something that you really weren't prepared for, maybe. You know, you just said, How are you today? And for once they actually told you, , you know, so often when we ask, How are you people don't tell us how they really are. But then you get that person who tells you and it's not good and you're, Wow, I didn't expect that. And you step into a real awkward situation. So first, let's talk about. Our side of things when we are when we are the ones who are going through a difficult time. And you talked about finding the people that you can talk to. That's a really important part of it. How also can you handle it when someone does say something that's either insensitive or just not caring? Is there some self care that we can pull out of our pocket in the moment? I guess vulnerability always puts you up kind of on the defensive. You know, you kind of have your walls up waiting for the face to fall or someone to say something to remove themself from your pain. So at that very moment, and you realize, oops, this might be the wrong person. He's gotta, yeah, you gotta put the wall up and protect yourself and say, this is not the right person. Important thing I have learned is cuz I've looked for these people and I've asked them beforehand, and if you are gonna go to this part of friendship with me, you gotta know this part of my life and you've, I'm gonna warn you, heads up. I got a son coming outta prison. I'm gonna need a lot of help coming up when that date happens. Are you in this with me? And then, you know, then I'm not worried about it. And what that does is when I'm with other people, I don't feel the need to share this part of my life. I don't need to feel like I just had a probation officer come over to my house. I just put that out here on a podcast. But this is a course as a safe setting. I, I wouldn't share that very often because most people, and nor do they need to know about. But for my people, they knew he was coming over. They knew the conversation we had. And then I got the text and the phone calls later that said, How'd it go? You know, Do you guys make a good plan? These are the right questions, but they knew, and the rest of my life is handled, then I can continue to be me again. I'm a pastor, I, you know, I don't, I cannot overshare this stuff from the pulpit Right. But I have my people, and that makes it, all of them more manage. I'm not seeking affirmation or seeking like, well done Brenda. I'm, I don't have to have that. My people do that for me, and that's enough. And I recognize that need as a person in ministry leadership to have that inner circle. So I'm glad that you're also saying everyone really needs to have that inner circle of people that you can be raw and vulnerable and talk to, and that can really help put us in the p in the position where we. Have stress and things building up inside, and all of a sudden we're telling the clerk at the grocery store all about the, you know, whatever's going on in our life. And she's like, Wow, . You know, cuz that can happen. Exactly. It. Well, it does happen for those people who haven't prepared themselves for this and then you're there. Then you get to that second part of your question then we're the ones saying, What do I do? You know, do you want to enter in? Cause you just got heard something that probably wasn't appropriate for the setting, but the person has been alone and isolated in that pain. And then you just said something that sent a flood and you know, good for you to be even listening to your friend, but. Was this the right time ? Right. Right. So I want to hear from you as an expert as to what are some of the good things to say. I'll tell, but I'm gonna be vulnerable and tell you some of the things that I tend to say, and I hope they're right. But you're, But. You tell me because if they're not, I wanna know so that I can do the right thing. So when someone shared something with me I might say something like, Wow, that sounds really difficult, or, I'm so sorry you're going through that, or something like, like that. What do you think about those types of responses and is there something better? Nope. I like those. Cause what both of those are saying to me is, You're with me in. You just felt the difficulty. Even if you can't, you know, I've, even if you don't know what prison is like in my situation, you just felt the difficulty enough to stay with me in it, and that's a very important signal. Right. Well, the one thing that I don't appreciate when I have shared something hard with someone is then they immediately tell me their story, and I feel a little bit selfish like that, but I didn't tell you I did. I wasn't vulnerable with you so that you could share your story with me. I was vulnerable with you because I. A need somewhere. And so I do really try to do, to not do that, even if their story does remind me of something that happened in my life because it's not about me because Right. Cuz that story they just told you, just this removed yourself from my pain and their story is resolved it's come to an ending and they've learned from it. They found that where God is in it, you know, God has become certain again. And it's resolved, but I'm still in this unresolved state. My story says to you that God is uncertain cuz how could God allow this to happen to me? So I'm going to flip the script and tell you where God rescued me. God came through for me and he did. And it's a true story and I believe you're being kind, but you're not helping me at all cuz you just removed yourself from my pain and I just need to be heard. And then I need you to say like, I understand, or even if you don't, because my story I know my story could make you feel uncertain, could make your faith uncertain. I know my story could make you doubt God. Like how could God let this happen already? I know that, which is why I don't share it very often.. But if I. I felt that opportunity to share and then I just get your story of how you've resolved it already. I'm not there yet. Right. So you didn't help me. I mean, I, and I probably won't even, and I probably won't even remember your story as one, as an example to help me get through because I'm already going, Oh, can't trust back, back, back. You know, And it didn't, so it didn't do any, Right. And the other thing is when someone even could minimize my pain because they've been through something that they view as even worse, you know? And yes, you can't measure someone's loss. One person's against another's, you know, we, A loss is a loss no matter the cause or the loss, right? It's a loss to that person. So I can't. Your situation, Well, that's not as bad as my situation. You wouldn't believe what I'm going through with my kids. You know, that definitely doesn't help because it's minimizing your pain, right? If you begin this with, at least you don't have my child, you're right there. You just compared it and you just removed yourself in my pain again. You know, I learned a really big lesson when I was 19 years old from Psalm 18. It's been my favorite psalm since this moment. It has supported me through every dark season, every dark season, but in when I was 19 and I found this psalm, I was dumped by a guy that was not good enough for me, but I was in so much pain, and I'd run into the word of God, and the psalm became my lifeline for that season of. A stupid guy who I, you know, don't even find on Facebook cause I don't care, you know? But that at that point in my life, that pain was severe and that's what's God's to be ministered to by somebody you trust. And you know, and even back then, I had people that just spoke and said, What is the, you know, what, Have you found this in the Bible? And that's not often a good thing to say because the Bible can be so misinterpreted or you're already angry at God for something that happened., I mean that. But at that moment, she led me to Psalm 18 and I will never forget that psalm. And as my pain has exponentially increased over my years I know that at age 19 the Psalm gave me truth and support at this age in dealing with what I'm dealing with now. It's the same truth and support. I've learned it, but I was told it from somebody when I was 19. Well, you've said a couple of things I think are really significant, especially when dealing with young people or people who are in a different place spiritually or emotionally or mentally or all of those things. People feel things differently, and so thinking back to that, Relationship when you were a teenager with your eyes of a mature woman, you might be tempting to, to say, Well, that was not a huge the, it's not the big event. I thought it was then, but you were feeling what you were feeling and that they were your feelings then. And you can't look at someone else and say, Oh honey, you don't even know what pain is. You know, you've got boatloads more coming, , you know, that's not coming ahead. Right. That's not gonna help much. But I love how you're talking about being present with people, being in the moment with people, because when you do that and stay with someone for a little while, then it gives you the opportunity to maybe share that message of hope from your point of healing. Because some of us have gone through things that God will use those stories then to bring hope and healing into the life of someone else. But you have. Earn the place in their life to be able to share it. And that comes after you have sat with them in their pain for a season at least. At least for a time. And you get their permission. Yes. Yes. Me just read something to you outta my book, one of the pages just about that I already, I woke up in this morning and the flood of my tragedy is defining. You tell me who I am, and of course these are these people, right? I will only hear you half of the time. Maybe there'll be one thing you will say and I will repeat it to myself over and over and over again, clinging to it because it must be true because you said it to me because it's you who is telling me the truth and I can hear it and I may forget it tomorrow, but right now, can you tell me it again? I trust. Then I wrote on the other side of this tragedy, Oh, wear a t-shirt declaring this cuz then I'll remember it and I'll remember you forever. Wow. Thank you for that. Tell me a little bit more about the book. How can people get it? Because I like that you said too, that it's a quick read or short chunks, things that you can just take bit by bit you. You're not going to have to invest a whole lot in a counseling degree to figure out how to handle people who are going through trauma or loss or grief or anything. It's practical, real advice that people can use. So how can we get our hands on it? Thank you. Well see the book looks like this and it's this thin. Wow. Yeah, that's manageable. And then it's got, see, it's got doodles in it too. It just emphasis, it's just good. So you can get this, you can get the soft cover copy on my website, brave store.com. It's brave, s t e r.com because when you order the soft cover, You get this wonderful card that I made to match it, and this is a card you can give to that someone, maybe you don't have the words to say, but you wanna be This person outside of it says, I wish I could take away your pain. I also promise to not tell you everything happens for a reason. The inside says, I'm sorry this is happening to you. I'm not afraid of your pain. I won't have all of the answers, but I will be here for you with coffee. Am I not perfect wisdom? We'll find God in this horrible thing together. Wow. So you get this card, or you can get extras of this card on my website also for that order. Otherwise, you can get this book in Kindle on Amazon. Okay. But it doesn't come with the card that I think. Most of your friends would like to receive from you? I think so, for sure. I love your website, brave stir.com. There has to be a story there. How did you come up with that? Brave stir.com Again, 40 years as a pastor, I worked all those years with teenagers. You mentioned, you know, ugh, love, love, love, believe in teenagers, teenagers will break your heart, you know? And I've just have notice. Over time, just I'm, you know, sticking with it, sticking with these teenagers. Some of my oldest teenagers I've worked with are now in their fifties and I'm still in their lives. I'm still walking through this faith with them. It's not always been easy. And I just, but this has just been brave decision to brave decision to brave decision. You get your heart smashed, you go back in with this kid, and you work and you work and you trust God for the larger story because that's who God. So this is, I recognize this pattern of my life and how I made my decisions in my life. Like all of my decisions when I read Dr. Brene Brown's research about 15 years ago about wholeheartedness, and it's all about being not afraid of the vulnerability because you're worth walking into the vulnerability, and it's always these brave decisions that define you and make you whole. And that just described my life so well. And so I used to write just youth ministry resources for 25 years. Then I decided to write more resources about just what a brave faith looks like. And it's full of this vulnerability. It's full of the day to day brave decisions. It's full of those moments when your, your gut clench. And you're like, you're talking to a friend, do I say something or do I just listen in this very moment? And if I listen, you know, then do I say something here? I mean, it's those tense, those, I call it holy tension. Like we're in those 10 moments. But if we stay in them and not exit out of them, not numb out of them, not divert, whatever, Something holy's gonna happen. And that's what a faith looks like. I think that's, this is what I've been teaching most from my whole adult life. That this is what a brave faith looks like. And then your life is this adventure wholehearted, and you got, you're full of wonderful stories where God shows up. I feel like it gives someone else a little bit of your courage to. Can carry them through to the next moment. It's an affirmation too, that there is hope for the future. Maybe I don't even feel brave, but I can make the brave decision or I can be carried on someone else's bravery for a little while. So, Brenda, thank you for that. And I just love all of the things that we've talked about today. I can't believe our time has gone so fast, but I wanna give you an opportunity to say just one closing thing. What do we need to hear before you go? Feel attention in my gut here. Make a brave decision. Cause I thought I was gonna say something, but I'm gonna change it. Cuz you mentioned hope, and this is such a part of this, I mentioned in my book that I need, I need hope. I need to know that hope is hang on, pain ends, that there's an end to this. And my people get to tell me that because they run with me and then they, you know, it's just in the book. Another thing I learned from Brene Brown that I just wanna apply in this moment when you've trusted God and you've made that brave decision and it hasn't turned out the way you thought it would your son who you raised. Yeah. I didn't give birth to my sons. But I have raised them for over 30 years now, and two ended up in prison Anyway, that was not my hope when I took them on, you know. The ability to make a plan B. In my hope, my, my plan A was got my boys as young teens fill them with Jesus, fill them with unconditional love. They're gonna be just fine. No . There was a lot they had to overcome. A lot of wounding, a lot of healing that has just taken. And so I've been able to continue to hope in God's plan for them because I've seen through my own life how God has showed up every time I've not been afraid to trust God for big things, like, and I went into the ministry very young. I already began with this big trust in God that you called me. I'm a woman. It's in the early 1980s. I am trusting in you. And I've had, you know, I've had men in the church. Try to dash me and I'm like still hanging onto God and hanging onto this call making a plan B. Okay, You don't see my call. He will see my call. You know, I'll go here and I'll, you know, and it's just been one plan B after another, after another. And this comes, and this is again from science research pump Renee Brown, because I believe I'm worthy of something good happening to me, even in when I'm in that smashed heart, overwhelmed. I don't know where God is anymore. I know cuz of my faith in God that I'm worthy to have something good happen to me and I have got the tenaciousness inside me to make a plan. B, I don't offload my hope to God. Hope really comes down to the brave decisions we make to say, I am sticking with you, God, you showed up for me when I was 19 years old when he gave me Psalm 18 showed up for me at this point and this point and this. I have hope right now. I don't see you, but I still have hope and I have learned, and I'm being reminded from my people. Hang on. Pain ends well, Brenda, you are a woman, I can tell, has a lot to offer. I wish we even could go into some of that more because there's a lot there. I'll have to have you back on Radical abundance for. I'll have to wish you a radically abundant day. Thank you. I will come back. Thank you. Great.